The W3C Credentials Community Group

Verifiable Claims and Digital Verification

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Credentials CG Telecon

Minutes for 2020-08-18

Dave Longley: Regrets+
Kaliya Young is scribing.
Wayne Chang: Topic: Intro & re-introduction
Joni: Executive Director of DIACC
Dmitri Zagidulin: Software engineer in decentralized identity and credential space. Co-chair of SDS, written various did resolvers in node and part of possibly way to many standards bodies.
CG Bot joined the meeting.
Joe Andrie: former co-chair of this group. Small consulting Legendary Requirements focused on decentralized identity and blockchain

Topic: Announcements

Wayne Chang: Announcements -- No upcoming events.
IIW is October 20-22
Wayne Chang: Thank you to Manu Sporney for his contribution to a Jitsi server
Wayne Chang: We should reserve updates about this soon.

Topic: Action Items

Wayne Chang: Progress and action items. Multi base mutli-hash hash linked items
Wayne Chang: What is Multi-hash?
Kim Hamilton Duffy: Owners should speak to it.
Manu Sporny: These specifications deal with identifiying binary bites of information that have to with a cryptogrphic hash
Manu Sporny: It is like a tool kit for folks working on VCs and charters have expired at W3C task force - we need to hit a button to bring them back to life we can believe they are more done when VCs
Manu Sporny: If the group feels we should continue this work we can or just let fade away
Wayne Chang: Took me a while to get on, so hopefully I didn't miss the update portion [scribe assist by Daniel Buchner]
Christopher Allen: Question for manu - blockchain commons looked into potentially using these - these are hashes main use. IPFS never moved on to keys they have been promising that for 4 years we gave up on this. we have moved to CBOR where we are being more productive working with existing libraries.
Christopher Allen: Coding hashes with CBOR and IPFS.
Manu Sporny: ChristopherA CBOR doesn't solve the problem - ORIE has gotten more keys into the registry so multi-key is now there and many of us are planning to use this for DID methods if you are going to use CBOR-LD you can use multi-base and mult-hash they are complementary
Daniel Buchner: We use and rely on them
Daniel Buchner: And will continue to
Manu Sporny: IPFS and many people are using them - uptick in interest. I think they are still relevant and the key stuff is being addressed. People are not spending a lot of time.

Topic: Ecosystem Updates

Wayne Chang: Starting with DIACC
Wayne Chang: What organization stands for and vision
Joni: Appreciate opportunity
Joni: Digital identity authentication and council of Canada - 75-80 members (They fund us) members from public and private sector - federal government, treasury board secretariet ect.
Joni: many technology organizations providing solutions and services. We were created out of a mandate out of the minister of finance of government of canada
Joni: we have taken a economic focus - what can digital identity do to move GDP
Heather Vescent: +1 Pan Canadian Trust Framework!
Joni: work publishing papers, inform decision makers - principles - open standards being one of them. Pan Canadian Trust Framework focus on guidance and timelines for people. Broad surface
Joni: the scope of what we are looking at with Pan Canadian trust framework - legal, policy - technical and LOA - private and public sector interoperating together. Distributed landscape. Technology model agnostic. Componentized used in different ways. should be able to be used for (old-school) federation and new emerging identity ecosystems. Networks for identity. range of different flavors and kinds of networks.
Joni: SSI - to trusted operator type networks. Pan Canadian is reaching 1.0 - we are alpha testing the framework with public and private sector networks - starting to circle around verify a digital wallet.
Joni: what does it mean to verify a network. Not there yet on verification of network or wallet.
Joni: public sector profile is more focused on public sector issuance of credentials for public sector uses
Joni: would love to hear from folks who would like to collaborate or engage. Get involved on twitter or via linkedIn - we do many public consultations everyone is welcome.
Wayne Chang: Decentralized Identity Foundation - Dan Buchner
Daniel Buchner: DIF organization leans on the engineering side - some other efforts too glossary. Tend to be on engineering things people need for implementation.
Daniel Buchner: Credentials or wider in scope.
Juan Caballero: Left out KERI, heeeeey
Daniel Buchner: Identifier and Discovery - universal resolver, did well known config, DIDAuthentication - SIOP compatable.
Daniel Buchner: Working with OPenID foundation for a joint group on this.
Daniel Buchner: Working on presentation exchange - helps you care less about the wrapper envelopes
Daniel Buchner: DID communication group work that joined from Aires
Daniel Buchner: Sidetree method group
Daniel Buchner: New group Secure Data Store group - underpinnings of what hubs could be built on later.
Daniel Buchner: Secrets recovery is being worked on at MSFT.
Daniel Buchner: Three groups working on ZKP that rounds out our efforts.
Daniel Buchner: DIF is a 501(3)6 it is free if you have less then 1000 employees
Juan Caballero: In addition to recent educational content, there are also articles on recently-initiated work items there
Drummond Reed: TOIP
Drummond Reed: Launched the first week of may 27 member companies - now at under 120
Drummond Reed: Hosted by the Linux Foundation it is a JDF project - it can produce pre-standards specification. WE have an open participation policy. Takes a few min to join.
Drummond Reed: Paid small company and big company options.
Drummond Reed: Goal of TIOP interoperable stack - decentralized ID and decentralized
Drummond Reed: Layer one DID
Drummond Reed: Layer 2 DIDCOM and siop
Layer 3: protocols
Layer 4: trust ecosystem
Drummond Reed: There is a governance side of the stack and a technology stack
Drummond Reed: The goal of the effort is interoperability - to move - may take years to have a fully interoperable trust over IP stack.
Drummond Reed: There are 6 working groups right now - one on technical stack one
Drummond Reed: Decentralized semantics moving to Trust over IP
Drummond Reed: Human Experience working group is starting for all dimensions of human trust.
Drummond Reed: Working groups join weekly.
Drummond Reed: Just added a program-Manager
Drummond Reed: Trying to make mailing list and wikis and githubs - and make everything open and transparent.
Drummond Reed: Anyone interested in developing things TOIP compatible. interested in working with all groups
Karyn Bright: Women in Identity
Karyn Bright: Thanks for the opportunity - northwest of England
Karyn Bright: In existence informal pull it together in a more formal way - clear vision and mission.
Karyn Bright: Identity solutions that are intended for everyone be built by everyone.
Karyn Bright: Starting out with a clear vision and purpose - grow membership groups around this.
Karyn Bright: Started out as a formal networking support network to meet others at conferences.
Karyn Bright: Became apparent wanted to see wider representation in identity - racial diversity and disability and identity making sure everyone is represented. 1100 members around 60 countries
Karyn Bright: We manage this via ambassadors
Karyn Bright: Supported by sponsorship
Karyn Bright: Supporting via communications now moved to webinars and virtual meetups.
Karyn Bright: Now thinking about our vision 2021 what people want is support with career development.
Karyn Bright: Mentoring programs and interested in that - what resources do we need - we thought people wanted technical help. what our mission now is helping women and underrepresented groups in the industry.
Karyn Bright: Ultimately not going into competition with the industry - we are working with them to get more underrepresented folks on panels.
Karyn Bright: Partnerships with others
Karyn Bright: Women in - follow all the links to join
Heather Vescent: Thanks for joining us today and giving us an update Karyn-Bright
Wayne Chang: Look around working groups identity groups diversity
TelegramSam C: Hyperledger Aries
Sam Curren: Project that is focused on off ledger interaction based on on-ledger assets and trust.
Artifacts include common libraries that are rest callable. Frameworks .net python go
Sam Curren: Humans bad at doing crypto in our heads we need agents to do that.
Sam Curren: Addition to agent code we need test frameworks and dev code.
Sam Curren: Aries Links:
Sam Curren: Aries interop profiles - specific integration targets. fixed target by teams wishing to integrate. stable target to integrate to
Sam Curren: DIDComm version 1 alive and well inside the aires ecosystem. Version 2 is on the DIF.
Drummond Reed: Links for Trust over IP: Website -
Sam Curren: More then just an idea working cross credential exchange multiple for interoperable. originally Hyperledger Indy but now broadening to others.
Sam Curren: Agents can work with multiple.
Sam Curren: Interacting with people improved. Goes along way to man in the middle attack prevention
Sam Curren: Credential echange (Sorry missed a bit)
Sam Curren: Focused on code not on design - lots of good stuff
Wayne Chang: Topic: Q&A and discussion
Heather Vescent: One of the reasons I wanted to hear about all these groups. I would like to see the groups work together. I was just curious to hear from some of the groups and your actions for working WITH other groups.
Sam Curren: Areas that mentioned - there is enough work to do - more people working on it wanted to do it moved over to DIF.
Sam Curren: Similar thing happening with presentation exchange with DIF - personally I think that is nice when stuff happens that solves our problems so nice when we solve it from the ground up.
Drummond Reed: With trust over IP we are explicitly helping assemble and integraete components. DIF, W3C, etc we are all about how do we bring this together into interoperable stack. With our program manager we are going to be trying to set up liason relationships to respond
Adrian Hope-Bailie: So I hear the word interoperable - repeated all the time in this and other contexts and my perspective I don't hear anything that looks like interoperability bluetooth logo etc.
Adrian Hope-Bailie: Is this my problem - how are we going to translate interoperability into a finite series of badges that people will undersatnd.
Daniel Buchner: I think to some extent we are ab it early. - we are seeing the components becuase it is something being heavily worked on - presentation exchange stuff
Drummond Reed: To Adrian's point, the ToIP Foundation is explicitly focused on trust marks and certification programs for interop. We have developed a specific type of deliverable called a ToIP Interoperability Profile (TIP) to help drive interop. More information here:
Daniel Buchner: So the exchange credential work is using same logic
Daniel Buchner: More success in the next 18 months then we have in the last 3 years
Wayne Chang: W3C credentials community gruop - cultiveate new work - community reports, registries of things, figure out where things can graduate to become standards.
Wayne Chang: A lot of our prerogative to support new proto-standards to graduate to standards bodies
Juan Caballero: Interoperability the DIF interop working group has been re-chaired (Juan, Kaliya, Pam)
Juan Caballero: Overview of existing prior art is where we are starting. SVIP, DIACC, TOIP, we have a good place to start
Juan Caballero: Interop WG agenda: (includes link to vote on meeting time :D )
Wayne Chang: Ecosystem updates - updaters what is your favorite example of interoperability in the ecosystem.
Daniel Buchner: DID core spec - presentation exchange - won't have as much problem if we keep guts of logic
Drummond Reed: As co-editor of DID spec - lean towards that
Drummond Reed: Agents that speak DIDComm that speak SIOP
Sam Curren: Personal favorite that is starting a long time Indy was the only ecosystem with a variety of credentials that we did - we are seeing broader adoption of these - heading towards more interop with ZKP - future of that. We have collectively figured out ways to get benifit in new ways
Juan Caballero: Universal Wallet CCG work item when?
Juan Caballero: :D
Wayne Chang: Sounds up on the up- on up if it was a crypto currency I would buy a lot of it.
Juan Caballero: My favorite interop is yet to come!
Wayne Chang: We will ajourn early
Juan Caballero: Wallet interop!
Daniel Buchner: Orie is a shillionare
Orie Steele: Because the question was asked universal wallet was proposed - spec, interop, still waiting for another company to endorse it to become an official work item.
Juan Caballero: ESatus and Trinsic ?
Mike Prorock: Orie, we will leverage and endorse the universal wallet spec
Juan Caballero: Thanks kaliya!
Wayne Chang: Thanks identity woman for phenomenal notes.
Manu Sporny: +1 Thank for scribing, kaliya! :)