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Verifiable Credentials for Education Task Force Telecon

Minutes for 2021-12-06

<kerri_lemoie> Can you hear me?
<simone_ravaioli> Anyone speaking yet ?
<kerri_lemoie> I think I'm having some mic issues.
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> we seem to have "lost" Kerri
<kerri_lemoie> can anyone hear me
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> (her connection at least, according to Jitsi)
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> no one hears ya, and your icon shows muted
<john_kuo> Kerri, it looks like you are still muted
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> maybe reload from a new browser? 😬
<kerri_lemoie> Sorry all
<kerri_lemoie> working on it
<kerri_lemoie> Can someone else unmute and say something?
<john_kuo> People are talking...
<kerri_lemoie> Ohh
<kerri_lemoie> Trying a new browser
<kerri> I can hear you all now.
<kerri> Hello all -

Topic: IP Note

Topic: Meeting minutes & recording

Topic: Scribe selection

Marty Reed is scribing.

Topic: Introductions & Reintroductions

KL: Introductions and reintros
<juancaballero> mazel tov!
Timothy Summers - new intro
Jessica Chung - new fellow at DOE
Jim Kelly - returning
JK- California community colleges

Topic: Announcements

CCG call tomorrow on VC-EDU
Timothy can you put your affiliation in the chat?
Next week, last meeting, Jan.3 next meeting

Topic: Co-chair Election Results

KL: voting result
Dmitri and Simone are the new co-chairs
<deb_everhart> congrats!
<sharon_leu> Congrats!
<timothy_summers> Timothy Summers, Executive Director Product Manager - Digital Trust, Founder/Lead Pocket, Arizona State University
<john_kuo> Timothy Summers: director of the Pocket initiative at ASU
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> 🎉
<john_kuo> Congrats!
<matthias_gottlieb> Congrats!
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> 🥰
Simone Ravaoli: :Blush:
<phil_l_(p1)> Contgrats Dmitri and Simone!
<kayode_ezike> Woot woot!!

Topic: Phil Long - Single Assertion Endorsements

PL: discussion on single assertion endorsements
<phil_l_(p1)> Link to my slides:
<kerri> Thank you to who is sharing
It's me
<kerri> Is my screen visible?
PL: starting with design principles
PL: most physical identity transactions are transient
PL: physical interactions degrade over time
PL: endorsements are technical and transient
PL: Endorsements must be accepted by the holder/endorsee
PL: Endorser presents bona fides in their endorsement - legitimacy as a credible reference
<kerri> Are my slides in your screens?
<david_chadwick> I have a black screen and no slides
<kerri> Thanks
<kerri> Sorry for technical issues. Can follow along here if you can't see my screen:
PL: other feedback on design principles?
<deb_everhart> goodn
<deb_everhart> good list
<adrian> The MITRE slide is actually credit to Chris Buchnan as reused by me.
<timothy_summers> :+1:
PL: funding exists for single assertion credentials for endorsement
<adrian> with permission by Chris.
Single assertion credentials for endorsements -
<simone_ravaioli> On design principles: Make it super easy to "endorse", like a FB thumbs up. balance tech implementation with UX.
PL: technical options - v2.2x OB example carries forward into OB v3 context
KE: the idea of endorsements including LinkedIn endorsements, Q: how do you think about verification
PL: how does one think about it from issued credentials versus self-issued credentials
PL: secondarily the process/mechanism of verification
PL: the verification here is aligned to the VC data model
AG: 2 kinds of endorsements, related to identity and related to validity
AG: real world identity is verified by notaries, is this necessary in the education space?
<john_kuo> I think you can do in in a single issued credential
PL: started from the foundation the person is accruing these credentials over a lifetime
PL: each credential should be inclusive of both identity and validity, but open to other methods
AG: cost related to identity is often 0, cost related to a credential is significant.
PL: make the creation of DIDs an easier process
PL: this would better align with the current world of, for example, notaries at public libraries
PL: DID linking approach
DZ: example of the use of multiple signatures
DZ: various signature methods allow for more than one signature and maintain integrity
DZ: what does it mean that 2 people find the VC
<juancaballero> Markus Sabadello even did a presentation (maybe at a DIF meeting?) about multi-proof'd payloads
PROPOSAL: Anchored Resources and Hashlinks for VCs https
DZ: what does it mean when an institution signs and then another party signs the VC, what is implied?
<juancaballero> ...and mentioned the aforementioned semantic black hole Dmitry is describing :D
Kerri Lemoie: @Juancaballero: do you have a link?
<kayode_ezike> Does proofPurpose in VC data model not resolve that ambiguity?
DZ: downside is that proof methods are various
DZ: they don't typically have the purpose of the signature at the top level
<kerri> Thanks! @juancaballero
<kayode_ezike> Gotcha 👍🏾
DZ: purpose is not always explicit
<juancaballero> (oops broken link)
AG: issue of liability of the intent of the signature, endorser is expected to keep a log of their endorsements, how far do we want to go down the rabbit hole of current world of required logs
PL: questioning what ways can liability be limited, but don't have legal interpretation currently
DZ: engineering perspective: do we know enough about the use case around an issuer or signature log
DZ: wallet project in DCC is currently struggling with this question
DZ: I haven't seen any standardizations at this point
PL: also relevent to Manu's proposal to status list
<juancaballero> ^ Specific issue
DZ: status list is just another way of linking
<juancaballero> about new types/enums
PL: #2 is symantic free
PL: referencing Manu Sporny hash link model
Marty Reed: Using smart contracts & hashed storage [scribe assist by Kerri Lemoie]
Kerri Lemoie: MR: create VCs as hashed storage and reconnect them on the user side.
Kerri Lemoie: MR: destination address is the contract
Kerri Lemoie: MR: example of destination is IPFS.; References chain
Phil Long: Create a single issue vc that describes where the endorser is giving background & evidence of their endorsement claim and then put it in IPFS which the wallet holder can point to. [scribe assist by Kerri Lemoie]
Kerri Lemoie: MR: allows them to store the endorsement, license, state & transcript - then package the three independently signed objects into a single signed one.
Kerri Lemoie: MR:beauty of using the hash model, if the hash is changed, then the VC is broken: multilayer protection.
<deb_everhart> very helpful explanation, thank you
<dmitri_zagidulin> I also have a proposal to the VC WG similar to this:
PL: John Kuo with pocket has an endorsement issuance flow
JK: advantage of having a closed system
JK: self-issued credential and portfolio credential
JK: there is a request for an endorsement for a specific identity
JK: the request can also be a standalone endorsement
JK: self-issued credentail - recieve request, interpret request, credential endorser signs and issues from their identity
PL: analogous to a professional org
JK: single asset example
JK: each endorsement credential is signed by a single entity
PL: lots more questions than answered in this discussion
<deb_everhart> would portfolio use case be similar to endorsing a verified presentation?
PL: focusing on design principles for clarity
<kayode_ezike> *831
<phil_l_(p1)> For contacting me, re: endorsement credentials
DZ: use of content hash as an alternative
JK: pocket intented implementation is hash and UUID
<deb_everhart> thank you
JK: answer to DE, yes
<juancaballero> or to put it another way, a portfolio could be expressed as a VP :D
<kayode_ezike> Cheers