The W3C Credentials Community Group

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W3C CCG Weekly Teleconference

Transcript for 2022-02-15

<heather_vescent> Hi David are you able to hear me?
<heather_vescent> David, here's the presentation decks:
Our Robot Overlords are scribing.
Heather Vescent: Good morning everyone today is the February 15th 2020 credentials community group meeting today our agenda is to have an overview of the did VC cryptographic debrief by David bailenson from esri and we're also going to get an introduction from camera day Linson who has self nominated for the open ccg chair roll.
Heather Vescent: .
Heather Vescent: So I would just like to remind everyone that as part of participation in the ccg which includes the mailing list and all participation including on GitHub are under the code of ethics and professional conduct we're just going to start reminding everyone of this at the beginning of the meetings so that we just remember that sometimes things can get heated.
Heather Vescent: And we do it.
Heather Vescent: Appreciate having passionate discussion that is also polite and respectful.
Heather Vescent: IP note anyone can participate in these calls however all substantive contributors to any ccg work items must be members of the ccg with full IP our agreement sign it's free to join but you will need to have a ccg w3c account and you can join here.
Heather Vescent: .
Heather Vescent: Minutes:
Heather Vescent: Call notes these minutes and an audio recording of everything set on this call are archived at the ccg minutes I know that we do have some gaps in that and it's been on my to do to fix those gaps and if anyone is interested in helping fix the gaps in archived minutes please let me know we use IRC and it's each a2q speakers during the call all attendees if you've used it C and you put your name in.
Heather Vescent: You will automatically be.
<manu_sporny> I can help with fixing some minutes gaps, Heather.
<mprorock> minutes gaps are likely my fault
<manu_sporny> *shakes fist at MikeP* :P
Heather Vescent: The CG bot will present plus you and that will show that you were a member of the attendant attack you attended this meeting if you would like to make a comment add yourself to the queue you can type Q Plus sign + and if you want to add a little note what you want to make your comment just you can say Q Plus sign the comment you want to make if you want to remove yourself from the.
Heather Vescent: EQ you can.
<mprorock> :)
Heather Vescent: - You might see the chairs doing other commands or other folks you don't need to worry about that this meeting is held by voice not IRC off-topic IRC comments are subject to deletion from the record okay scribe selection since we are using the auto transcription I don't believe we need an official scribes that correct amount and we just shifted this this process a bit.
Heather Vescent: .
Manu Sporny: That's correct yep I can I can back up scribe and fix things.
Heather Vescent: It's if you know how to fix things using the search replace feel free to fix things on the Fly.
Heather Vescent: .
<manu> example of how to fix things: s/OLD_TEXT/NEW_TEXT/
Heather Vescent: Okay introductions and reintroductions is there anyone new on the call who's not presenting who would like to introduce themselves you can either just speak up or do q+ and add yourself to the.

Topic: Introductions and Reintroductions

Heather Vescent: You okay I don't see any any one volunteering of be introductions is anyone not reintroduce themselves for a while.
Heather Vescent: Okay no takers on that either next up is announcements and reminders does anyone have any announcements or reminders Mike you're on the Q over.
<manu_sporny> woo hooo! Welcome Kimberly!
Mike Prorock: Awesome so we actually have a great announcement today as you hinted at which is Kimberly is joining us as a co-chair so she self-nominated a little while ago sufficient time has passed there have been no objections in fact quite the opposite and I am ecstatic to have her joining you in myself as a co-chair here I think she brings a lot to the table so with that wanted to pass it over for a quick intro and welcome aboard and thanks again.
Mike Prorock: .
<pl> Congratulations Kimberly!
<heather_vescent> yay! So excited to have you Kimberly!
Kimberly Linson: Thank you I'll come off mute and camera for a second mike and heather asked me to just kind of give a little brief introduction and sort of what I'm thinking about as I step into this exciting Adventure I'm really excited to to be a part of this team and hopefully I can I can bring some good Administration and help with some of the back back office stuff.
Kimberly Linson: By way of sort of an introduction I spent the first 20 years of my career in education management focused on a company that treats kids and adults with comprehension disorders and then in 2017 I left to start my own professional Learning Company with with kind of that idea in mind that that I really am fascinated by how it is that we humans come to understand things and then when I.
Kimberly Linson: Charted at Randa.
Kimberly Linson: Got sort of a baptism by fire and how humans understand things because I didn't come from a technology background and all of a sudden I was trying to to make sense out of what I was reading and I felt very much like I had that comprehension difficulty and so really the ccg was a landing place for me and gave me lots of really good.
Kimberly Linson: .
<pl> Wow - in Safari the chat seems to now be self-scrolling. Well done Jitsi devs!
Kimberly Linson: Short and and an easily digestible.
Kimberly Linson: .
Kimberly Linson: Bite-sized pieces of information for me to kind of grab ahold of and so that's sort of where I come from is bringing and trying to understand all that that we're doing here and I think I sit and kind of a hopefully a unique spot to to be able to help us with some of that communication and that matching up of language and mental representation.
Kimberly Linson: This is important to me.
Kimberly Linson: Because I actually really want my own credentials to be digital and verifiable and I want it to be seamless and secure and but I don't want to be a sheep who sort of just assumes that y'all did that for me without me understanding how it happened because I also want to be a part of helping to build these products for for the world which is very exciting so I'm hoping that I can really help us get from where we are today to to not just a.
Kimberly Linson: Place where there's adoption.
Kimberly Linson: Carrie and I've had lots of conversations every conversation I feel like always comes back to adoption but I actually want it to be just an expectation so I bring to the chair position I think some organization and management skills and I also bring a lot of curiosity my favorite Einstein quote that you can't see but it's right here in my office is if you can't explain it simply you don't understand it well enough so I'm I will ask lots of questions and.
Kimberly Linson: By doing that I can help the ccg to onboard more more voices faster that in order for them to be active voices and not passive voices they we have to feel confident in the knowledge that we have in the material so I'm hoping that I can continue what we've done with the ccg 101 and other tools that we can build on to help folks get get up to speed faster so that's kind of my my goals as I.
Kimberly Linson: Step into this role.
<manu_sporny> Super excited about Kimberly stepping up to co-chair! Hooray!
Heather Vescent: You thanks Kimberly and I'll just share with everyone like I met Kimberly through the ccg 101 project I don't really know her very well prior to that and I was so impressed with how she well just how she just asked great questions and helped us clarify and document some of the new things which was my goals for this ECG 101 and as we had this open co-chair you know I think I've been pretty clear it's been really.
Heather Vescent: Important for me to use.
Heather Vescent: Leadership of the ccg as succession planning so that folks can have different experiences and I was just so impressed with Kimberly and so when she was amenable to the co-chair role I was very excited I think she's going to be a great coach are really complementing both what Mike and I bring to the table so very excited for the ccg to have three solid co-chairs it's been.
Heather Vescent: A long long haul for me.
<mprorock> big +1 Heather, and very excited to be joined by Kimberly ;)
<kerri_lemoie> Thanks, Kim! Appreciate that you're dedicating time to this initiative. Great to have you as a co-chair to help shepherd the work of this group.
Heather Vescent: And I'm very active and excited that we're going to be able to create more things for the community and more structure for the community so with that let's see any comments or questions from the community for Kimberlyberly or what this what this means for the TCG menu your.
Manu Sporny: I just wanted to welcome Kimberly and and you know add to the excitement I think Heather you stated it well really happy Kimberly that that you started when in ccg you know 102 101 in our now co-chairing I think your backgrounds you know fantastically suited to the position have never really had a chance to work with you but.
Manu Sporny: To the next couple of months to years with you at the helm so just just wanted to vocalize my appreciation for you stepping up to co-chair and in taking this on that's it.
Heather Vescent: You thanks Manu.

Topic: Progress on Action Items

<heather_vescent> CCG Issues:
Heather Vescent: What else know okay great the next item on our agenda is to check in on progress on action items we don't really have much going on on the issues right now I will just make a note yesterday I walked Kimberly through creating some work items so there were a couple open work items they were approved that have been officially.
Heather Vescent: And the verifiable.
Heather Vescent: Fresh 2021 and the verifiable driver's license vocabulary so both of those are accepted work items and they should have their repos ready to go otherwise we've got a couple open work items that are looking for coach co-owners and then we have the vcj which interrupts test artifact which I think we've still got on hold until.
Heather Vescent: Till end of.
Heather Vescent: So we don't really have anything present burning going on those oh man oh you're on the cue or is that from previous.
<rgrant> i'm being dropped from the telephone line, and neither Chrome nor Firefox offer me audio. any hints?
Manu Sporny: Now this is a new one just wanted to mention that the one of the crypto suites at least I feel is really important to very firmly put in scope in the new verifiable credentials 20 working group this is the this is the one that all major Enterprises and governments use right we already have support for it through the Json web signature stuff.
Manu Sporny: Which is good.
<chris_abernethy_(> @rgrant - try visiting the URL directly, that's what worked for me in chrome:
<mprorock> @rgrant - try going on chrome to and then select weekly from there
Manu Sporny: That but this profile said in a different way so in order to cover all of our bases and ensure that the new working group has all of the tooling that it needs to really push you know the verifiable part of verifiable presentations Ford we really need a second coat or for this work item I know there's a decent bit of people saying that they support it but yet.
Manu Sporny: There's no no cone or.
<pl> @rgrant I'm finding Safari works well these days, if that's an option for you.
Manu Sporny: We don't get a cold enough for the item it doesn't get rolled into the VC 20 working group so it's pretty time-sensitive if you haven't well I mean you know if you're supporting it please consider becoming a calendar for it and helping us to get that into the BC 20 working group that's it.
<mprorock> I would note, I think it can go into the VC WG without a co-owner
Heather Vescent: Many what's a requirement to be a Kono co-owner like what kind of commitment is that.
<mprorock> just needs an IPR sign off
<orie> it can go into the VC WG without a co-owner.
Manu Sporny: It's really not a huge commitment it's a cryptography sweet and I mean it's a it's a fairly light lifts out of all the specks we do these crypto sweets are supposed to be the lightest lift from a technology perspective so you know like a day every two weeks maybe.
<mprorock> Orie i belive confirmed that with Ivan as well
Heather Vescent: So I'm seeing here in the chat that both make an Oreo saying it can go into the vis-a-vis he's working group of the out of co-owner.
Manu Sporny: I disagree with that viewpoint.
Manu Sporny: But you know maybe it's it makes it much easier if it's the ccg work item and there's a clear path that's ECG adopted it in where you know and it was here and then we're moving it to the working group the other way into a working group is you pick a random document off the internet that somebody wrote and there's always the chance that a w3c member is going to look at that and go why in the world are you picking that you know pulling that in verses the the incubation path.
Manu Sporny: That we've set up which is.
Manu Sporny: CG first and then into the working group.
Heather Vescent: Okay I hear you and Mike your own cue.
<dmitri_zagidulin> me says:s/cryptography sweet/crypto suite/
Ryan Grant: PL: thanks for the Safari tip, it did work!
Mike Prorock: Yeah just a quick clarification because I think it's important before we get into the meat of David's talk today which I'm looking forward to the man is correct right that incubation in one sense right the incubation path from ccg to the working group is easier more from a this is why we should consider this as a working group right standpoint right it just makes it easier but there's not a technical blockage it just it does make easier.
Mike Prorock: Someone's willing to.
Mike Prorock: Up and co-owned all that that would be great because I know it's important for managers perspective especially and I think it is important broadly.
Heather Vescent: Thanks Manny what's the do we have like a the deadline I'm a I don't think the ccg will put a deadline on this.
Manu Sporny: It's the verifiable credentials working group Charter when that Charter goes out to vote if this is not included in it it will not be in the charter.
<mprorock> WG charter - likely 30days tops
Heather Vescent: And do you have any idea when that is occurring.
<marty_reed> manu can you share the link to the work item?
Manu Sporny: They yeah I mean I think what Mike saying 30 days tops but they've been wanting this they've been wanting to do it by the end of the month which is two weeks away.
Manu Sporny: .
Heather Vescent: Got it Mario's all here's the here's the item right there.
Heather Vescent: .
Heather Vescent: So if you want to be a co-owner of a work item in ccg that's going to move to the VC working group verify your credentials working group and this is interesting to you and you support it talk to menu or just volunteer make a note on the thread that I just put in there to be a co-chair or not co-chair to be a co-owner.
Heather Vescent: .
Heather Vescent: Okay so I think we're finally ready for the main event this is this was a request from Anil John to have a.

Topic: Cryptographic Debrief of DIDs and VCs by SRI

Heather Vescent: Have enough time for us to go into the details of cryptographic debrief of did NBC's so I'm really excited that David bailenson from Sr is here and so David I'll pass it over to you and I'm happy to put the link of the PDF in whenever you want me to.
David Balenson: Yeah why don't you go ahead and do that thank you very much Heather and thank you all for having me here thank you to anneal for suggesting that I provide this debrief I recognize a lot of the names here and I'm pleased to see some new names as well I do want to emphasize I'm here at the sort of the request and behalf of the Department of.
David Balenson: And security side.
David Balenson: Oh Chief directorate where Anil John is a program manager for the Silicon Valley Innovation program and in particular one of their portfolios on blockchain and distributed Ledger technology research and development and we'll talk about that a little bit more in just a few minutes what I'm here to do is tell you a little bit.
<dmitri_zagidulin> Heather -- the presentation's needs public permission
David Balenson: Work that I and my colleague and SRA International did reviewing use of cryptography in the w3c verifiable credentials data model or be CDM and the w3c decentralized identifiers or dids standards as a part of this review we provided some constructive feedback and recommendations for technology developers and the w3c standards developers to help increase their level of compliance with.
<pl> ditto for me Heather
<heather_vescent> You should have access... it says it's open to all:
David Balenson: Standards we should have I'm not going to present the slides I'm not going to share them you should have the link that Heather shared in the chat and you should be able to follow along so I'll try to give you a mile post letting you know which slide I'm going I'm going to start with slide 12 the title slide I do real quick when a just briefly introduce myself and my colleague.
David Balenson: Briefly come off.
<pl> That now works Heather
<heather_vescent> Are you able to access it now?
David Balenson: Put a face to the name and the voice but myself I'm a senior computer scientist with independent nonprofit Research Center s RI International actually going to be celebrating my 10-year anniversary next month on the 12th of March I've spent most of my time providing technical programmatic support for the Department of Homeland Security science and technology directorate and a number of different programs.
David Balenson: Being some of the programs that Anil has guided just by way of background my research interest include cyber security for critical infrastructure and cyber-physical systems I've done quite a bit of work of late in Automotive Systems which is very interesting I'm also interested in experimentation and test technology transition multi-disciplinarian research cyber risk economics and usable security if you're interested in learning.
David Balenson: You can either Google my name and Sr i-- it'll take you to this page which I just dropped the link in there my colleague Nick Jenice unfortunately he recently left s RI he's now with a company called Duality which is working in privacy enhancing Technologies it's an incredible opportunity for him he's going to be working there with Shafi Goldwasser.
David Balenson: From u c Berkeley who some of you in.
David Balenson: The community may be familiar with she's very renowned and so I'm really excited that Nick is there but I do want to point out I'm I'm more of the applied cryptography Nick is the more theoretical and he Bridges the theoretical and applied aspects of cryptography and he did a bulk the bulk of the work that I'm going to be presenting here so I want to make sure that credit where credit is due and if you're interested in getting.
David Balenson: More information about knit you can also.
David Balenson: Google his name or I'll so paste the link to his website here.
David Balenson: All right so with.
Manu Sporny: Real quick interrupts David sorry do you want me to share the slides Heather or I mean I can try it's that or are we trying to not do that.
Heather Vescent: If you want to try sharing them anyway I'm just hesitant since we've had issues with the system stopping the recording and transcription halfway through so.
Heather Vescent: Or is it easier for me to share and you keep an eye on things I don't know.
Manu Sporny: I got you let me let me try and share I'll keep an eye on everything if that's okay let me share from my machine just because I'm fairly I we've done that on other calls and it's worked out okay so I'll I'll I'll share.
Heather Vescent: Great okay thanks Manu.
David Balenson: All right so I'm ready to move on to slide to title this VIP blockchain and DLT portfolio.
David Balenson: There you go so for those of you who aren't familiar with the Silicon Valley Innovation program or S VIP they work to leverage commercial Rd Technologies in government applications and co-invest and accelerate their transition to the market one of the portfolio's that they've worked on in among many that they've had over the years is one on blockchain and distributed Ledger Technologies this is intended.
David Balenson: Many different uses and applications as you see here there is a really strong emphasis as I'm sure and you'll John has shared with you on architecture standards and interoperability his intent is to Overlay any solution with global openly develop standards based data models in API hence the solutions are based in part on w3c's be CDM and did standards.
David Balenson: .
David Balenson: Stop real quick and just ask Anil if he has anything further he wants to say to introduce either as qualia or this talk before I continue.
David Balenson: .
Anil John: Further he wants to say to introduce the either at the probably 0 or this talk before I continue thank you Dave no I'm good I think I will just answer the question that I was asked on Lincoln about this particular work whether what is The Next Step Beyond you're doing this work I think that is up to the community from the government perspective I think it is really important to realize that if you want to be using the Republican.
Anil John: Angels and decentralized identifier BAE Systems.
<orie> audio is a bit low
Anil John: Government The cryptographic Primitives need to be set up in a manner that actually meets the federal information processing requirements and this Chris cryptographic standards so we wanted to make sure that we did a deep dive you know by the funding that we you know provided to you know you know Dave and Nick at esri to understand The cryptographic Primitives that are currently usable cryptographic agility that is possible within the standard such.
Anil John: It's that you.
<pl> @Orie audio is fine at my end.
Anil John: You know swapping that I live in crypto or not and that is sort of the intent and we obviously will be using the results of this in order to ensure that whatever profile that we are going to be using of the verifiable credentials and decentralized and fire in our work actually supports fips-compliant cryptography it cryptography going forward so on that note Dave back to you.
David Balenson: Perfect and that's a perfect segue into the next slide Manu.
David Balenson: So as Daniel said US government use of the Technologies must conform to relevant federal government standards and requirements and in particular the federal information security management act or fisma and that in turn requires use of National Institute of Technology or nist standards for use of cryptography so on the next slide say a few more words about fisma this is a rather word.
David Balenson: That's the nature of government regulations but the key things to note here is that federal agencies have to provide information security for the information and systems that support operations and assets of the agencies they approach this by applying risk management trying to understand the potential threats and risks and harm that could happen and.
David Balenson: Those are appropriately and they need to comply with information security standards and guidelines as well as mandatory required standards developed by nist and so in the next slide nest promulgates what are called federal information processing standards Publications or fist pumps they're the official series of Publications relating to standards and guidelines that are promulgated.
David Balenson: The provisions of bhisma are issued by nist after their approved by the Secretary of Commerce and where is in early days agencies could get waivers fisma does not allow waivers to mandatory Phipps pumps so these are required for any federal government agency and it's required for protection of sensitive unclassified information so it's important to note that this does not pertain to.
David Balenson: It's covered either by National Security or national security systems that's a whole domain of its own and even though these are primarily required in intended for federal government use the fact is they may be and frankly often are used by non federal government organizations such as private and Commercial organizations in fact there's many benefits to commercial organizations taking advantage of fisma.
David Balenson: It's in their commercial product they benefit not just their government customers but they can sort of help raise the bar and and benefit any and all customers that use their products next slide please.
David Balenson: So the work that we did is to review the w3c vcd m and did standards and their use of cryptographic operations for conformance to the nest cryptographic standards we did this in two phases we reviewed the relevant standards and came up with an initial set of recommendations and then in the second phase we reviewed those recommendations with the community including many of you who are here today and then updated.
David Balenson: David the recommendations based on the feedback that.
David Balenson: These recommendations have now been officially published they are still what's there in a final form there not a draft but the fact is these types of requirements and recommendations are never static always Dynamic and I believe part as an eel said when he commented earlier the intent here is to introduce this to you and to the community and to eliminate.
David Balenson: And one can Envision that as we move forward over time either DHS S&T or Sr i-- or some part of the community perhaps some of you may update these to reflect situation is as things evolved finally I want to point out that we primarily focused on the cryptographic algorithm used in the w3c standards we did not actually look at a portfolio.
Mike Prorock: +1 There will definitely be updates needed post NIST feedback on PQC
David Balenson: Or their use and operating operational systems we really just looked at the be CDM and did specs and their use of cryptography next slide please.
David Balenson: A little bit more background the primary fits pubs related to cryptographic standards and hopefully many if not all of you are familiar with these are those for secure hash for keyed message authentication code for digital signatures Advanced encryption and also security requirements for cryptographic modules so these were the.
David Balenson: Phipps pubs that were of interest to Nick and myself however there are quite a few other nist special Publications ittf standards and informational documents even some research papers that are out there on archives and other other platforms and there are other documents that were very relevant and so I would encourage you to see the references section in our report there are a total of.
David Balenson: That provide a really good sort of bibliography of all the relevant standards and and other documents that relate to the use of cryptography in support of be CDM and and ID's next please.
David Balenson: I probably don't need to spend a lot of time getting in to what are verifiable credentials and dids just just in case a verifiable credential is at a evidence that of claims made by an issuer that can be cryptographically verified the vcd m-spec provides a standard way to express them that is cryptographically secure privacy respecting and machine verifiable and a classic example.
David Balenson: Ample that I think is used in the spec in.
David Balenson: Necklaces here in this briefing is an issuer such as the Department of Motor Vehicles issues a credential to a holder driver sends verification information in the form of a digital signature to a verifiable data registry which could be a for example some government website and then a verifier such as Highway Patrol can verify that credential that digital signature by checking the registry and that's sort of very quick high-level idea of.
David Balenson: Of what is meant here by verifiable.
<anil_john> Not exactly .. but OK :-)
David Balenson: On the next slide we talked about distributed identifiers these are globally unique persistent identifiers that don't require a centralized registration Authority and are often generated in a registered cryptographic cryptographically and examples of these might be a street address or an online user name.
David Balenson: Next slide please.
David Balenson: There are a number of different ways in which these verifiable credentials may be distributed through different data Registries examples here are trusted databases decentralized databases government identity databases distributed ledger so the technology is somewhat agnostic to how these credentials are stored and accessed for verification purposes and in many cases there could be more.
David Balenson: More than one.
David Balenson: Street that's utilized in a particular ecosystem next please.
David Balenson: So one of the first things that Nick and I had to do when we started tackling this was to understand the VC DM and dids standards and any references they made to cryptography and we quickly found that it was a little bit of a maze of twisty passages all different than anybody is familiar with the old Adventure game so we put together we found it was extremely helpful.
David Balenson: .
David Balenson: Together a graph representing how the specs reference existing cryptography and so if you if you look at the chart here it's not critical to see the exact words but the dark circles represent w3c standards or specifications the green Square in the upper left hand corner that's actually an Especial Pub the yellow Square in the upper right hand corner is a Mist Phipps.
David Balenson: And some of the gray.
David Balenson: Simon's that you see here are ietf RFC s so if I'm not mistaken the VC DM standard is let me see I got a squint a little bit here.
David Balenson: It's in the lower left the large black circle and so you can see there's a somewhat indirect and circuitous path it gets from BC D em all the way to the nist Fit sport for secure hash and then the upper left hand corner you can see that there's a large black circle that represents the did specification and it connects directly to a nest special public so.
David Balenson: It was very helpful.
David Balenson: To lay this out understand the landscape this serves as a visual aid as well as a summary of what's being referenced in the did the CDM and did specs and hence what you need to pay attention to when you're implementing those specifications so now the next slide I'll give an overview of the recommendations that Nick and I made you'll see that there is a.
David Balenson: A number of.
David Balenson: Series of recommendations that we made General recommendations pertaining to security strength or B security and keying material a number of areas of algorithms and protocols including hash functions block ciphers Max signatures key agreement and transport layer security and then just another set of miscellaneous recommendations involving crypto validation programs crypto agility documentation in a few.
David Balenson: Other factors that you see there.
David Balenson: And what I'm going to do in the short time remaining is I'm just going to briefly touch on each of these just sort of give you an idea as to what are the primary recommendations that we've made we don't have time to go into a lot of detail into any of them if you've got questions certainly entertain those at the end and ultimately what I recommend you do is take a look at the document itself it is accessible I will provide.
<heather_vescent> We will also dedicate next week for more discussion.
David Balenson: Thanks for that later and you'll be able to take a look in more detail at the recommendations but for now I just want to give you an idea as to the types of things that Nick and I are recommending need to be implemented in order to help facilitate compliance with government requirements and standards so let's go ahead and Jump Right In leave the first slide is set of General recommendations and so this includes things such as tracking the security.
David Balenson: Evil as provided by.
David Balenson: Nest of each individual component as well as the overall bit security of the scheme so anytime you're making reference to a crypto scheme you've got to think about and consider the overall level of security or B security for that scheme implementation should use approved cryptographic modules whenever possible the use of each cryptographic key and the randomness that's used to generate that key.
David Balenson: Should be used for a single.
David Balenson: At the graphics team so nest and and various other documents recommend that keys that are used for example for digital signature or only used for digital signature and are not also used for for key exchange and then it's also recommended that you delete all Randomness that's used to encrypt and used to generate Keys as soon as possible within an implementation so you don't want it to be lying around in memory as soon as it's been used it should be.
David Balenson: So these are some of the general recommendations that we made now getting into the algorithms and protocols first and.
David Balenson: Guard 2 hash functions you should be familiar with hash functions we don't the document talks a little bit about what they're used for and how they're constructed here just note to very important security properties preimage resistance and collision resistance the former is important for message authentication codes the ladder for digital signatures since usually signed the has hash of a message so these are obviously things that one needs.
David Balenson: Is to consider and take into account and.
David Balenson: Choosing an implementing hash algorithms on the next slide.
David Balenson: Make some specific recommendations for government compliance purposes one should only use the algorithm specified in either the secure hash standard or secure hash algorithm three or secure hash algorithm three derived functions you should Implement all hash functions using approved cryptographic modules that's going to be a recurring theme and I'll talk later a little bit about this crypto.
David Balenson: Algorithm and module validation programs and then finally tracked the security strength of each hash function as well as the type of security specify and describe the security strengthened the type of security in the standards and other specifications themselves.
David Balenson: They going to General block ciphers and Max should transition all block ciphers to the advanced encryption standard or AES and one should avoid using Mac's that are built on TV EA and use at least 112 bit key lengths the chart pitch you see here is taken from nist special publication hundred 131 on transitioning the use of cryptographic.
David Balenson: Rooms in Kiel.
<mprorock> Ma, I haven't seen skipjack in a while
David Balenson: So it shows the approval status of different symmetric algorithms used for encryption and decryption and so one needs to be keenly aware of that and at this point it's time for everything to transition to from from the old T DEA and skipjack to using AES.
David Balenson: The next slide we get into digital signatures I'm going to send that most of you are familiar with digital signatures and not going to go into a lot of detail here but generally we apply a hash function to the message or data and then we will use an asymmetric or digital signature algorithm the private key to generate the signature and then the public key to validate that signature.
David Balenson: On the next slide.
David Balenson: We show a number of recommendations the most relevant standards here include the digital signature standard which specifies a number of different algorithms that can be used as well as the use of hash functions within the secure hash standard and secure hash algorithm three additional recommendations include using approved random number generators to generate the random keys and to treat all Randomness or seed material as.
David Balenson: Protected as one would in the nist recommendations for Key Management and to use approved random number generators to generate Randomness for signatures and to delete that Randomness as soon as possible after it's been generated and used to generate the necessary keys.
David Balenson: The next slide talks a little bit about Kiri use in applications you should recall one of the general requirements was that King material be used for only one scheme and not from multiple schemes there apparently is some work on doing key reuse between these two particular standards the x.25 519 in the Ed to 5519 by DHS DSS.
David Balenson: And other Phipps forbid.
David Balenson: Using keying material between cryptographic schemes we are aware that there has been some some work there's an ie CR e print article that claims to have proved that there this is secure and that we don't question that and we don't really evaluate that that may well be the case but the fact is the required Phipps pubs from this do do forbid that and as part of our.
David Balenson: Work Nick and I did Reach Out.
David Balenson: Talk with a number of the subject matter experts and key people at nist and they're aware of all this but until they make any changes in the standards any federal government organizations that wish to make use of these algorithms have to abide by the Phipps and they have to ensure that there's no reuse of the king material between the two schemes.
David Balenson: We talked about key agreement number of recommendations here treating Randomness intermediate values is King materials removing those values from memory as soon as the application or algorithm allows generating all the random values with approved random number generators with a security strength at least as high as the key agreement scheme itself and then when feasible a nonce is random string should be twice the length of the targeted security strength.
David Balenson: For the key agreement scheme and if you're curious.
David Balenson: Learning more about that again you can look at the report and the reference to tubs and other documents and they can tell you more about why that is and then finally in the the last area under algorithms and protocols transport layer security all TLS protocol implementations currently have to be versions 1.2 and 1.3 and there's a plan to transition that to all 1.3 and as the last time Nick and I look at this.
David Balenson: The requirement is that requirement was that that transition occur by 2024 you're hearing a little bit of a recurring theme use this approved Cipher Suites and the servers and clients and TLS must use mr. Krug cryptographic modules so now let's go ahead and move on to the final set of recommendations this is.
David Balenson: .
David Balenson: About mish-mosh of a number of different categories but I'll start out by talking about the this cryptographic validation programs you've heard Us site recommendations talk about recommendations that require using validated modules so if you look at the actual missteps pubs for the different cryptographic algorithms they specify they may be implemented as modules comprised of software firmware Hardware.
David Balenson: There are and they also missed his established this cryptographic algorithm validation program or tabs p and a cryptographic module validation program or see MVP to validate modules for conforming to the nest security requirements for cryptographic modules and other fifth standards there's a full series of fips 140 standards that talk about cryptographic modules and.
David Balenson: Recommendations is that implementations should use validated cryptographic algorithms and modules whenever possible and you can learn more about those if you're not already familiar with them through the through the fips 140 series and the other Phipps documents the next recommendation relates to crypto agility and given different algorithm Suites that are out there the fact that algorithms.
David Balenson: Evolved over time.
David Balenson: As new developments as new systems are adopted and standardized it's important that systems provide cryptographic agility that allows them to swap out different algorithms that can achieve the same cryptographic goals and and this is now especially important considering future use of post Quantum cryptography.
David Balenson: If you're not yet tracking nests work on post Quantum cryptography and I know many of you are in fact doing that which is wonderful but if you're not we strongly encourage you to do so because this is something that is going to be required in future standards Nick and I as I mentioned did talk with the folks at Nest they have a multi-year program where they're developing standards.
David Balenson: Geography in both the digital signature and key exchange spaces and in coming years anticipate issuing fits pubs that will require standardized use of those algorithms if you want to learn more if you're not familiar with them there are a number of useful resources that are out there DHS has an entire site on it at the link that you see here they're partnering and working very closely with nest and there are two nests.
David Balenson: Sites that are especially useful in.
David Balenson: You'll see.
David Balenson: Explore here including one on the whole public post Quantum crypto standardization effort and another on a crypto agility project.
David Balenson: The next slide just summarizes the anticipated impact of quantum Computing on common algorithms and what the future needs are going to be in the bottom line is that the asymmetric algorithms for digital signatures and key exchange are no longer going to be secure the other algorithms for doing block ciphers and hash will be okay however larger key sizes and larger output are going to be needed so one not only.
David Balenson: Ed's when thinking about.
David Balenson: To agility not only needs to think about swapping in different algorithms but the different parameters and sizes of those parameters that are associated with the different algorithms.
<mprorock> assume that SPHINCS+ and or a lattice based approach will come into play (e.g. DILITHIUM)
David Balenson: The next slide is a DHS infographic on preparing public key cryptography and it just talks about steps that different implementers developers and standards organizations should be taking into account as they work toward and prepared for eventual incorporation of public key cryptography I want to wrap up I realize that we're nearing the top of the hour the next.
David Balenson: .
David Balenson: Stations are around random number Generation all entropy Source output should be single-use don't don't use an output for multiple uses treat the entropy sources is keying material we've alluded to this earlier if a deterministic random bit generator uses a hash of block Cipher security strength should be larger than the desired security strength of the whole system and of course use approved validated entropy sources.
<mprorock> to note that this discussion will continue next week from an implementation standpoint
David Balenson: Final set of recommendations involve w3c documentation we strongly encourage you to write all of your standard documents with crypto agility in mind we also recommend that you take into account the fact that government organizations that are going to use implementations based on your standards need to use government required mandated.
David Balenson: Crypto algorithms and.
David Balenson: The more you can do to help facilitate the developers implementers and using those algorithms the better and it's also helpful to include block diagrams that describe the algorithms and systems input output Behavior especially given the large number of different parameters including you know random number seeds other parameters that can be input or output from from the algorithms.
David Balenson: Because all of.
David Balenson: Who's that need to be considered when it comes to cryptographic security so final slide ssris recommendation report the good news is our recommendation report is approved for public release so it is available to you it does describe all of our recommendations in more detail than what I've been able to share here as I mentioned earlier it also contains an extensive set of references to relevant standards guidelines and document so.
David Balenson: Obviously I think.
David Balenson: Is is valuable it does include license terms that allows Open Access and use and there are a couple of links here and I see Heather's already dropped those in the chat and one of them is to a forum posting that anneal made and the other is to a link to the Google Doc and I believe a nail is also working to get the document posted on a DHS site and I also have it posted under my.
David Balenson: Our eyesight so multiple different paths by which you can get the recommendation report so I'll stop there and fortunately I've left a little bit of time for questions unfortunately it's not a lot of time so I'll go ahead and stop there and see if we have any comments or questions that I can answer before we wrap up.
Heather Vescent: Thanks David also want to let everyone know that we are going to dedicate the full ccg called next week to discussing what's been presented here as well okay Mike you're on the Queue I think we'll just take one or maybe two questions to really end at the top of the hour so Mike.
Mike Prorock: Yeah exactly and thanks Heather and I did want to note as you did that will be continuing the conversation next week in particular from an implementer standpoint so going to be looking at folks like Orie, Manu, Charles you know anyone from the Spruce team etcetera right anyone that's touching at the underlying side of some of the stuff to make sure that we're being mindful of some of these potential security issues that could exist if.
Mike Prorock: We adopt some of these.
Mike Prorock: Some of this type the wrong way so that's going to be kind of the topic for next week is a preview before I send that email out you know tomorrow or something so.
David Balenson: And I'll mention that Mike did invite me to join next week and I am available and I do plan to join so I'll be able to participate in that discussion and help answer any questions that might come up at that time.
Heather Vescent: Thanks David I think that these recommendations are really great I think one of the challenges that a lot of private sector companies that don't have experience working with or creating technology with government use cases in mind is really understanding the government use case and and understanding why you know these recommendations are so important so I hope that were able to help support.
<mprorock> and in some of these items, like PQC they go far beyond gov
Heather Vescent: Getting the word out about these things.
<pl> Fantastic presentation - Thank you.
David Balenson: Thank you for having us.
Heather Vescent: Okay we don't have anyone on the Queue we're almost at the top of the hour and so we'll conclude for today we'll continue our conversation next week thanks everyone thinks it's a man who's and everyone for subbing thank you for the transcriber for transcribing thank you David and Daniel for presenting and thank you Kimberly for stepping up and joining as co-chair.
<manu_sporny> Yes, wonderful presentation, thank you David!
Manu Sporny: All right looks like everything happened just fine Heather this time around so we got a full recording all audio everything should be there.
Heather Vescent: Great great thanks I'm planning to spend a little bit of time cleaning up some of the minutes are not cleaning up putting putting putting them in its up I know we've got some pretty big gaps in there so now that we've got the co-chair role filled I can spend a little bit time on some of that backlog.
David Balenson: .
Manu Sporny: Some a Heather just a note on the the transcriber from today if you want I can pre-process it there times where the speech-to-text stuff just injects to random words as a sentence in the middle of everything I have a script that can just rip all that out so that you get a really clean version to work from if you're interested in that.
Manu Sporny: .
Heather Vescent: Yeah that would be that would be great I mean you and just send it to me is like a textile or upload it somewhere or I mean you don't have to do it today I'm just happy to be able to add some additional like like housekeeping with some of the ccg stuff now so.
Manu Sporny: How about this I'll do the weekly minutes from this week and last week because I scribe last week and this week I've if they're really clean so it should be pretty quick.
Manu Sporny: .
Manu Sporny: That work for you Heather.
Heather Vescent: Yeah but I mean also you do so much already.
Manu Sporny: No it's okay this is this shouldn't be a this this it shouldn't be difficult I've been doing the VCH API minutes and it's been starting to take like 10 15 minutes now with the new transcriber and everything.
Heather Vescent: Okay okay that's great I have a lot of backlog I think we have from last year I know I used to be pretty good with minutes but there was there was a time when I did kind of dropped the ball a bit so I'm trying to clean that up and just want to you know just want to clean house and make it tidy and dollar eyes and cross all our T's.