Wayne Vaughn: Hear you great ✪

Chris Winczewski: Scribe+ ✪

Joe Andrieu: Introductions [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Chris Winczewski: Jeff Stone and Nathan representing from Learning Economy ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Reintroductions ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Adam Lemmon from Emergence Tech ✪

Joe Andrieu: https://w3c-ccg.github.io/announcements/ ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Announcements ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Identiverse is now virtual over several weeks ✪

Kaliya Young: DIF is hosting an intro next week [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Link will be posted to IRC ✪

Juan Caballero: https://www.eventbrite.com/e/dif-face-to-face-virtual-tickets-106632396368 ✪

Chris Winczewski: Lucy_Yang: Representing CCI. Supporting privacy preserving covid credentials ✪

Joe Andrieu: Action items [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Joe Andrieu: https://github.com/w3c-ccg/community/issues?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Aissue+label%3A%22action%3A+review+next%22 ✪

Christopher Allen: Voting system details are being finalized. Hope email will be sent out today. [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Votes will be tallied by volunteers and results published the next week ✪

Joe Andrieu: https://transmute-industries.github.io/universal-wallet/ ✪

Joe Andrieu: Universal Wallets presentation from Orie @ Transmute [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Orie Steele: https://transmute-industries.github.io/universal-wallet/ ✪

Orie Steele: https://nfc.did.ai/nxp?seed=7052adea8f9823817065456ecad5bf24dcd31a698f7bc9a0b5fc170849af4226 ✪

Orie Steele: Spec and demo links above [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Would like to speak for a bit and then open up for questions ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... A number of demos are used and all of them use various services (e.g. key storage) ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Interoperable wallets inevitably come up ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... The goal is to create a data model and abstract interface for wallets ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Trying to create a data model that accounts for how these identifiers, currencies, etc are all related ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... And how to abstract for interop ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Data cannot be moved from one system to another is we don't have a common data model ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Reference implementation for one use case to show how this would work ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Trying to build a vocabulary vs creating new and potentially duplicate data models ✪

Joe Andrieu: https://transmute-industries.github.io/universal-wallet/ ✪

Joe Andrieu: https://github.com/transmute-industries/universal-wallet/ ✪

Christopher Allen: https://github.com/BlockchainCommons/Research ✪

Christopher Allen: Some Bitcoin and Ethereum wallet providers trying at the base level (e.g. what is a seed) to come to agreement [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Christopher Allen: https://github.com/WebOfTrustInfo/rwot9-prague/blob/master/topics-and-advance-readings/whats-wallet.md ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Could the community, or DIF tackle some of the naming issues? RWOT link above for What is a Wallet? ✪

Orie Steele: DIF did tackle glossary terminology a little while ago... not sure if there is a link that can be entered for future readers. ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Arrows within these models also need to be named ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Starting small with vocabulary. Tech interop (e.g. CBOR) will come later ✪

Joe Andrieu: Where to you see this going from here Orie? [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Orie Steele: Trying to gather interest from CCG and DIF to support this initiative [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Margo Johnson: Re: Orie's comment about DIF glossary work, here is that presentation from recent work include wallet, credential, agent ecosystem analysis https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1gIEPmbtLNVuaHxdawGBe6ZwFqP43m7iqmIEeUUm3sjI/edit#slide=id.g752184a474_0_4 ✪

Christopher Allen: I'd like to see this diagram updated: https://github.com/WebOfTrustInfo/rwot9-prague/blob/master/topics-and-advance-readings/media/ExpandedDecentralizedIdentityNetworkComponents.png ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... If there is support then let's come together. Supporting a work item is preferred. ✪

Wayne Vaughn: This is a wallet interoperability initiative? [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Orie Steele: Yes, import/export representations for wallets to be used together [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Wayne Vaughn: Naming topic, could we modify the name "Universal Wallet?" [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... What about porting key pairs from one wallet to another ✪

Brent Zundel: This may be valuable information for a way that part of the community thinks about wallets: https://github.com/hyperledger/aries-rfcs/tree/master/concepts/0050-wallets ✪

Orie Steele: Moving keys is a risk but it is a thing that the community does now. Vocabulary can help clarify what moving keys means and what the risks are. [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Christopher Allen: When developing the BTCR wallet and the underlying BTC wallet, we learned a number of things (e.g. Air Gap) [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... The diagram is missing a number of pieces such as Shamir and revocation ✪

Brent Zundel: Also related: https://github.com/hyperledger/aries-rfcs/tree/master/concepts/0051-dkms ✪

Orie Steele: Its definitely a hard problem... thats why we are tackling it :) ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... It turns out this is a difficult problem across all of the crypto wallet families. We don't have representation from these groups here as well. ✪

Orie Steele: I have opened this issue targeting hyperledger interoperability: https://github.com/transmute-industries/universal-wallet/issues/9 ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Need group to agree so we don't do the work but then everyone just continues with their own wallet ✪

Kim Hamilton Duffy: Support from the educational credential side as there are currently a lot of wallets in the wild [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Orie Steele: An we get a link to ILR wrapper? ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... ILR, which is a type of VC, is focused on discoverability ✪

Joe Andrieu: I don't know if the ILR paper is published yet ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... There will be interest to integrate with a number of identity providers ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Possibly take this on in the VC EDU Taskforce ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Usability for the learner is also critical, since the wallet is usually the entry point into this tech ✪

Orie Steele: Here is another UI demo which attempts to expose some usable UX for this: https://material-did.com/?path=/story/components-universal-wallet-wallet--unlocked ✪

Margo Johnson: Re: Orie's comment about DIF glossary work, here is that presentation from recent work include wallet, credential, agent ecosystem analysis https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1gIEPmbtLNVuaHxdawGBe6ZwFqP43m7iqmIEeUUm3sjI/edit#slide=id.g752184a474_0_4 ✪

Brent Zundel: This may be valuable information for a way that part of the community thinks about wallets: https://github.com/hyperledger/aries-rfcs/tree/master/concepts/0050-wallets ✪

Brent Zundel: Also related: https://github.com/hyperledger/aries-rfcs/tree/master/concepts/0051-dkms ✪

Joe Andrieu: Margo and Brent added links for parts of the conversation above [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... ILR was light on wallet. This Transmute spec is very helpful to go deeper ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... About webkms; the spec mentions this. Can you speak to how webkms fits in? ✪

Orie Steele: Bottom line, don't move private keys if you do not need to. Generate keys on the device and authorize them [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Webkms is meant to hold keys behind a web interface ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Keys mentioned in a wallet could be present in a secure enclave or other method such as webkms. ✪

Joe Andrieu: Similarity to Bitcoin. Wallets do not hold your Bitcoins [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Christopher Allen: https://github.com/blockchainCommons/bc-lethekit ✪

Christopher Allen: We are increasingly finding that we want to use device differences to separate private keys. For example, link provided. [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... The master key is never on the device which is on the network ✪

Christopher Allen: Ur:crypto-hdkey/5vql2q6cyyqw3uewwg77eaq9rth6er3vj0yutvs5xyup0ndsrg2ffwgheppkkdgytqsgw00ls8qz75jky073legk06kr54dqf80r6v2tkshwyflla5ma2zqwu4mr8 ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Network device is separate from the storage device. This doesn't work for all use cases but should be considered ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... CBOR example which is optimized for QR codes ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Wyoming laws with regards to private keys - Stockholders can now be represented by keys. Corporate records can now be stored on chain. ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... May also add capability for the Secretary of State to issue civic records ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... A bill which protects private keys from compelled disclosure also introduced. Should be taken up in next legislative session. ✪

Joe Andrieu: For keys to perform their magic, they need to be kept private [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Christopher Allen: This is the private key bill in Wyoming: https://wyoleg.gov/Legislation/2020/HB0041 ✪

Orie Steele: A note about the bar we are trying to meet. Indy credentials format for example needs to be included [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Software implementers and standards groups need strong collaboration from the separate groups ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... If you represent a community that you feel is not well represented, please reach out ✪

Christopher Allen: There are a lot of assumptions in crypto currency wallets that make some assumptions that can cause problems [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... For example, automated account creation vs answering a request from the netwok ✪

Chris Winczewski: S/netwok/network ✪

Orie Steele: +1 To the value of reference implementations ✪

Orie Steele: Especially multiple ones in different languages ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Some things are only discovered when implementing ✪

Jonathan Holt: Caution to separate key management from wallet management [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Christopher Allen: +1 I think there is a lot of collisions here ✪

Christopher Allen: I also want to separate keys from accounts from wallets ✪

Kim Hamilton Duffy: I'd be interested in helping untangle key/credential management. The EDU use cases will force that along ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Could be problematic for example, associating keys to the correct accounts within the wallet ✪

Christopher Allen: Keys, accounts, credentials, wallet ✪

Orie Steele: Great point, it is easy to destroy privacy unintentionally [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Future state could be that the wallet warns you of these scenarios with key association and disclosure risks ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Adversary builds off what they can see so the motivation behind the metadata is to balance this ✪

Wayne Vaughn: Has there been investigation into DPKI and KERI? [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Orie Steele: If you have a kms now, you would represent that in a JSON data model. Not intended to commingle separate kms tools [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Orie Steele: We support HD Keys ✪

Joe Andrieu: Please type +1 HD key if you do, or plan to, support HD keys in your wallet ✪

Christopher Allen: Do your tools plan to support HD Keys? Type +1 in chat if you are. [scribe assist by Chris Winczewski] ✪

Chris Winczewski: +1 ✪

Orie Steele: But for secp256k1 only ✪

Jonathan Holt: Is HD in 25519 a thing yet? ✪

Orie Steele: Is it secure? ... jury is out... ✪

Chris Winczewski: ... Yes in 25519 but it is a challenge ✪